PKMN.NET Forums
Pokémon Games => X and Y/OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire => Topic started by: .~.Nellie.~. on May 30, 2014, 15:19
-
Hello everyone :) I've recently started to dabble in the realms of competitive battling. I have a team that I'm juggling with but I feel like it's not working completely for me. I know I need some kind of earthquake counter since that hits my team pretty hard. Any suggestions on how to make my team more rounded? I'll list the Pokemon that I alternate between using in my team. I could really use all the advice and help that I can get ^^. I'm not into the incredibly strict Competitive Battling scene or into the tiers as this is mostly me learning the basic ropes for battling with friends of mine :)
Currently I use:
Garchomp
Nature: Jolly
Ability: Sand Veil
Item: Garchompite
Moves: Poison Jab, Earthquake, Outrage, Stone Edge
EV Spread: Attack, Speed (remaining IVs in HP)
Houndoom
Nature: Modest
Ability: Flash Fire
Item: Weakness Policy
Moves: Sunny day, Solar Beam, Flamethrower, Dark Pulse
EV Spread: Sp. Atck, Speed (I think the leftover EVs are in HP)
Tyranitar
Nature: Careful
Ability: Sand Stream
Item: Choice Band
Moves: Stone Edge, Aerial Ace, Earthquake, Stealth Rock
EV Spread: Hp, Sp. Def (Remainder in Attack)
Sylveon
Nature: Bold
Ability: Pixelate
Item: Leftovers
Moves: Toxic, Moonblast, Wish, Refresh
EV Spread: Hp and Defense (Remainder in Sp. Def if I remember correctly)
Gourgeist
Nature: Impish
Ability: Frisk
Item: Spooky Plate
Moves: Leech Seed, Phantom Force, Pain Split, Trick or Treat.
EV Spread: HP and Defense (remainder in Attack)
Nidoking
Nature: Timid
Ability: Sheer Force
Item: Life Orb
Moves: Thunderbolt, Sludge Wave, Earth Power, Ice Beam
EV Spread: Sp. Atk, Speed (I think the remainder are in HP)
Lanturn
Nature: Calm
Ability: Volt Absorb
Item: Rocky Helmet
Moves: Surf, Confuse Ray, Toxic, Thunderbolt
EV Spread: Sp. Atk, Sp. Def (remainder in HP)
-
If this is singles, you are going to have a bad day.
Although Garchomp is quite fast before megaevolving, its speed is reduced once the second turn it is a mega. Therefore, a fully Jolly nature without taking into consideration its very decent special attack is horrendous. Nevertheless, this spread and moveset are ideal of Scarf or Band Chomp.
Let's face it: Houndoom will die with any super effective blow, especially when it is weak to all entry hazards. Moreover, without external Sun Support, Solar Beam is almost useless. Why not from Houndoom itself? Because it will not tell the tale. This is specially counter productive with Tyranitar. In fact, Houndoom needs a lot of patience, effort and experience to shine.
Choice Band Tyranitar demands a heavy attack investment to break walls. If you are planning to turn it into a wall, yes, go careful... but a Band is not a bright idea, especially when you are using SR on the same set. Assault Vest would be a better idea for this one... or leftovers if you want to keep the rocks. Aerial Ace is actually good to counter incoming Fighting Types, but do not rely on it too much.
If you are using Pixilate, you might as well go with Hyper Voice: it does not care about substitutes and annihilates practically everything (no one likes screaming fairies) neutral... with a bad special defence. Without moves to set up (Calm Mind, for example), Hyper Voice loses a lot of power, and a Bold natures does not help at all achieving power. However, the other moves are ideal for a Wall.
Gourgeist has a problem: it does not need Trick-or-treat; any Pokémon can switch out to avoid the damage from Phantom Force... or even get you off-guard and send a Normal in and obtain a Normal-Ghost Pokémon, which is only weak to Dark. By the way, which is the size of this one? Depending on it, a set can completely vary.
Nidoking is good as it is, but should move its remaining 4EV from HP to any defence (in case you enter a Spikes Field or you are burnt).
Darn, this Lanturn is trollish... until you realise that its EV spread is not ideal. The fact of forcing switches to poison Pokémon is... decent or good, but its spread is far from ideal. If you want to wear them down, use all EVs used in SpA and put them into HP. And the remaining ones... in defence. However, I don't think you will be using Rocky Helmet that much, especially when this Pokémon is weak to moves that usually do not require contact. Moreover, Lanturn can be outsped; hence, it can lose the chance of doing anything if you aim for a Confusion.
-
Hey there! I can see you've put forth a good effort in your first team, so congrats there! Allow me to make suggestions :)
Garchomp - Mega Garchomp is actually weaker than Life Orb Garchomp, not accounting for Sand. It's also slower, so I'd actually recommend Life Orb here unless you're dead-set on Mega Chomp. Here are the sets I recommend for Garchomp! (http://pkmn.net/?action=columns&page=viewissue&id=58)
Houndoom - Too frail to take a Super Effective hit to activate Weakness Policy. Honestly, Houndoom isn't good in OU. I can recommend something else if you'd prefer, but for now I'll say you want Timid on Houndoom and drop Sunny Day and Solarbeam for Nasty Plot and Hidden Power Fighting and give it Life Orb as well. If this is for in-game, that'll be difficult to get, but honestly this slot could be better filled by many Pokemon.
Choice Band Tyranitar is a great choice, but this one's a bit confused on what it's doing. Choice Band wants max Attack, since that's the reason you'd use Choice Band in the first place. Also, Stealth Rock on Choice Band isn't great. I'd suggest either of these two:
Tyranitar@ Choice Band
{Sand Stream}
Adamant nature (+Attack, -Sp. Attack)
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Attack / 4 Sp. Defense
Crunch
Stone Edge
Pursuit
Superpower / Earthquake
This is more of what a Choice Band set hopes to accomplish. Crunch and Stone Edge are great STABs, and Pursuit checkmates Latios and traps Psychic types in general. Superpower is a 5th gen tutor, so if you can't get it, I'd go with Earthquake. Alternately, Fire Fang is a weak option, but it can be used in the last slot to hit Ferrothorn.
Tyranitar@ Leftovers
{Sand Stream}
Sassy nature (+Sp. Defense, -Speed)
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Sp. Defense / 4 Attack
Stealth Rock
Pursuit
Crunch / Stone Edge
Fire Blast / Stone Edge
This is a support Tyranitar that can set Stealth Rock for your team if necessary, and takes Sp. Defensive hits very well, especially with Sand buffing his Sp. Defense. Pursuit once again puts Latios in a position where it either switches and dies to Pursuit, or stays in and dies to Crunch. Crunch is here for just that reason, but Stone Edge can be used here for the coverage. Fire Blast in the last slot hits Ferrothorn, or you could run both Pursuit and Crunch alongside Stone Edge.
Sylveon looks decent, but we can make it better. The only reason to run Pixelate is if you have Hyper Voice, a tutor from B2/W2. Heal Bell does exactly what Refresh does, but for the whole team. I'd suggest Protect in place of Toxic, so you can make the most of your own Wishes, if necessary. Run Cute Charm if you're not using Hyper Voice, since Pixelate is wasted on this set.
Nidoking looks good :)
Gourgeist is awful, unfortunately. It's not a good enough Pokemon to compete in OU. Trevenant can be, but I'd suggest something like Ferrothorn here instead if you want a Grass type. I also happen to be fond of Mega Venusaur, but it doesn't work well inside of Sand, since Sand ruins Synthesis and Sand also chips at M-Venu's health. Ferrothorn is unaffected by Sand, and can lay SRock or Spikes. If you choose SRock, TTar can go with the Band set, and if you choose Spikes, TTar can provide the SRock as well.
Lanturn is completely outclassed by Rotom-Wash in OU, who also has Levitate to remove the Ground weakness, meaning it's only weak to Grass. Lanturn can be a good special wall but it's not good in OU, which your team is competing in.
Here are some suggestions:
Your team is incredibly weak to Ground, and opposing Garchomp will have little problem sweeping your entire team, especially considering Mega Garchomp is slower than normal Chomp. Rotom-Wash can, once again, be of assistance here, and would fill Lanturn's spot nicely. I can provide a spread and set for you if you'd like.
Houndoom isn't good in OU, it's just not. It's unfortunate because it's a cool design, just not a good Pokemon. Depending on how you choose to move forward with your team, I'd suggest different options for what could go here.
Garchomp doesn't need Poison Jab. The only good Fairy types in OU are Mega Mawile, Azumarill and Togekiss. This slot would be better filled by either Swords Dance, Fire Blast, or Stone Edge.
Nidoking is a bit meh in OU as well, though it's not a bad Pokemon by any means. It is mostly outclassed by Sheer Force Landorus Genie form, however.
Hopefully this has been constructive, and I'd be happy to help further! :)
-
Here are some suggestions:
Your team is incredibly weak to Ground, and opposing Garchomp will have little problem sweeping your entire team, especially considering Mega Garchomp is slower than normal Chomp. Rotom-Wash can, once again, be of assistance here, and would fill Lanturn's spot nicely. I can provide a spread and set for you if you'd like.
Houndoom isn't good in OU, it's just not. It's unfortunate because it's a cool design, just not a good Pokemon. Depending on how you choose to move forward with your team, I'd suggest different options for what could go here.
Garchomp doesn't need Poison Jab. The only good Fairy types in OU are Mega Mawile, Azumarill and Togekiss. This slot would be better filled by either Swords Dance, Fire Blast, or Stone Edge.
Nidoking is a bit meh in OU as well, though it's not a bad Pokemon by any means. It is mostly outclassed by Sheer Force Landorus Genie form, however.
Hopefully this has been constructive, and I'd be happy to help further! :)
Thanks so much for all of your helpful comments! I do feel like my team doesn't fit together as nicely as it should so I'm in need of re-evaluating my choices!
I'd really appreciate suggestions for a replacement for Houndoom. I had considered Arcanine but truthfully I'm just at a loss as to what to choose xD;
As for the ground weakness- yes. This is the gaping hole in my team that I am very much aware of xD I'd looked up Pokemon with levitate and also I'd considered Mandibuzz since I've seen a few people run quite good sets with them. I actually really like your suggestion of the Mega Venusaur- especially if I ditch my Mega Garchomp. I'm not mad on Rotom-Wash since everyone seems to use it :/ Are there any other Pokemon that might work decently in this role? If not I might just have to bite the bullet and jump onto the bandwagon.
Gourgeist had been working terribly for me and Lanturn was a hit and miss. It could be annoying but it died far too quickly to be any real bothersome threat. Houndoom, ironically has worked quite well for me so far and it has managed to stick around to use the Weakness policy, but I am quite keen to try something new in her place :)
I'd actually really like to get to grips with using my Nidoking in my team somehow since he's the most recent Pokemon I bred and I've get to realize his scary potential xD
I'm pretty much prepared to breed and re-do my entire team in the next couple of weeks as my exams are nearly over. Looks like I have some hours of breeding ahead of me in the future!
-
Glad to help!
In regard to a replacement for Houndoom, there are many options depending on how you prefer to play. If an offensive Fire type is what you're looking for, Talonflame, Infernape, Mega Charizard Y or X are all great options. Depending on what you decide, I can write up a set for any of them. I have, however, covered both Talonflame (http://pkmn.net/?action=columns&page=viewissue&id=55) and Charizard (http://pkmn.net/?action=columns&page=viewissue&id=54) in-depth, so take a look at those. :)
Unfortunately, as I said, Mega Venusaur and Sand mix about as well as Water and Oil. Venusaur depends on clear skies for Synthesis to be effective.
Rotom-Wash can't really be replaced by a Pokemon that does what it does, since only these 2 Pokemon have the Water/Electric typing, but you can use something like Jellicent as a Water type if you'd like. I wouldn't strongly recommend this, however, as Jellicent far too often sits on the battlefield without much of an offensive presence, is very easily worn down, and doesn't provide much for your team. I can provide a set for either of them. :)
If you're considering Ferrothorn for your team, I'd suggest this:
Ferrothorn@ Leftovers / Rocky Helmet
{Iron Barbs}
Impish nature (+Defense, -Sp. Attack)
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Defense / 6 Sp. Defense
Spikes / Stealth Rock
Power Whip
Leech Seed
Thunder Wave
Ferrothorn provides many useful resistances for a team, and can provide either Spikes or Stealth Rock. Stealth Rock is more important overall, but if TTar is using it, run Spikes. Power Whip is your best STAB unless you want to run Gyro Ball, but Gyro Ball pairs unfavorably with Thunder Wave. Leech Seed annoys any switch-in that isn't Grass type (other than Sap Sippers, Magic Bouncers and Magic Guard Pokemon), and provides somewhat of a buffer when switching out of Pokemon that threaten Ferrothorn, since the Pokemon you switch in will recover some health from the seeds. Thunder Wave cripples opponents upon entry, which is great for ruining opposing sweepers.
-
Before I start on nidoking, what did you see in him that you wanted? I just want to see if anything else could fit the bill better.
-
Nidoking only does one thing, Sheer Force LO. Landorus-Genie does it better, but it's hard to obtain in-game.
-
Glad to help!
In regard to a replacement for Houndoom, there are many options depending on how you prefer to play. If an offensive Fire type is what you're looking for, Talonflame, Infernape, Mega Charizard Y or X are all great options. Depending on what you decide, I can write up a set for any of them. I have, however, covered both Talonflame (http://pkmn.net/?action=columns&page=viewissue&id=55) and Charizard (http://pkmn.net/?action=columns&page=viewissue&id=54) in-depth, so take a look at those. :)
Unfortunately, as I said, Mega Venusaur and Sand mix about as well as Water and Oil. Venusaur depends on clear skies for Synthesis to be effective.
Rotom-Wash can't really be replaced by a Pokemon that does what it does, since only these 2 Pokemon have the Water/Electric typing, but you can use something like Jellicent as a Water type if you'd like. I wouldn't strongly recommend this, however, as Jellicent far too often sits on the battlefield without much of an offensive presence, is very easily worn down, and doesn't provide much for your team. I can provide a set for either of them. :)
I actually really like the idea of Talonflame as a Houndoom replacement. The only thing that sucks is how much Stealth Rocks would destroy him, but I feel like he'd be fun to try out regardless :)
I tend to go for the more offensive approach in my teams, then I'll have an annoyer (e.g. My Posion/Confusion Lanturn) and a staller (e.g. My Toxic, Protect and Wish Sylveon). I feel like I could probably do better for the annoyer as my Lanturn is very fragile and can usually only last to bother one or two 'mons.
So if we consider what I theoretically would have in this new team so far I'd have:
Nidoking
Talonflame
(I'd quite like to try your Sassy Tyranitar set or your Scarfed/Banded Garchomp) If I were to go with one, which would you recommend? I have a personal favoritism for Garchomp but I do love Tyranitar too!
I've seen some people run some pretty cool Protean Gregninja with Life Orb and U-turn. I'd quite like to try that out at some point too. There are just so many different things I want to try that I struggle selecting a single team xD And even when I do I feel like I select each member for their individual qualities rather than how they work together as a team. Hopefully that will improve with experience, though.
-
Haha, I think we all had that when we first get into competitive. The amount of fun things to try has grown a lot this generation, and it's hard to resist just throwing things like Greninja into any team. The best way to learn to build teams is both through trial and error, and learning the metagame. For serious competitive battling, you're going to find that the metagame only has a certain number of commonly used Pokemon, and you build teams around what you expect to see in battle. For example, Latios is a huge threat that you need to be prepared for in competitive battling, but you'd never prepare for something like Cacturne because you're almost never going to see it. Once you learn what the common threats are, you'll get better at team building, both through experience and knowledge. :)
Stealth Rock is a big problem for Talonflame, so you may want to pack a Rapid Spinner or Defog user, but it's not mandatory. If you go with Leftovers or Life Orb, Roost can mitigate the damage from it, though it can be annoying to force yourself into a Roost upon entry.
An annoyer isn't something I highly recommend. The term annoyer comes from Pokemon that have annoying moves, but to dedicate an entire team slot to a Pokemon that simply annoys the opponent puts you on the losing end of the deal since most annoyances can be broken through with sheer offense.
Tyranitar and Garchomp serve different purposes and can be used together on the same team if you'd like. If you are using them on the same team, I'd recommend the Sassy support TTar and this:
Garchomp@ Leftovers
{Rough Skin}
Jolly nature (+Speed, -Sp. Attack)
EVs: 252 Attack / 252 Speed / 4 HP
Substitute
Swords Dance
Earthquake
Dragon Claw
Substitute on something that switches out and Swords Dance safely. Garchomp forces many Pokemon to switch out, and this is why this set works so well. With the safety of the Sub, 1 or more Swords Dances are possible, elevating your Attack to frightening levels. That's when you're free to wreck with your two STAB attacks.
If you're going offensive, Greninja isn't a bad option. It's actually pretty good. Here's what I'd recommend:
Greninja@ Life Orb / Expert Belt
{Protean}
Naive nature (+Speed, -Sp. Defense)
EVs: 252 Speed / 252 Sp. Attack / 4 Attack
Hydro Pump
Ice Beam
Dark Pulse / Extrasensory / Hidden Power Fire
U-Turn
Greninja is a fantastic special attacker, and also has U-Turn to escape from unfavorable matchups. Base 122 Speed means it outspeeds the majority of the tier as well. Hydro Pump is Greninja's most powerful attack and threatens any OU Pokemon. Ice Beam grants excellent coverage against Grass types and Dragon types, as well as Flying types. The third slot depends on what you value. Dark Pulse has great neutral coverage and hits things like Rotom-Wash harder than anything else Greninja has, while also providing coverage against Aegislash and a few others. Extrasensory hits Conkeldurr and Mega Venusaur, but not much else in OU outside that. Hidden Power Fire nails Ferrothorn and Scizor.
It really depends on your playstyle what you use. Offensive teams usually want mostly powerful sweepers of different types, while balanced teams try to have 2-3 sweepers, 3 walls, and one utility Pokemon on the team (Defogger, Rapid Spinner, Wish Passer, Healer, etc.). Bulky Offense likes slower bulky attackers like Conkeldurr and Mega Venusaur that can keep themselves healthy while dealing out powerful damage. Stall aims to just not lose by setting up hazards and making defensive switches.
Once you develop a style, team building will come naturally. :)
-
Ohh alright! This sounds promising!
But if I have both Tyranitar and Garchomp then should I shake off the Nidoking? xD I'd have too much ground (which is my current big issue!).
So I could use:
Tyranitar
Garchomp
Talonflame
Gregninja
And I'll have to work out perhaps coverage-wise what else to try out...
Also you've reminded me of something that confuses me a lot xD; When people use Legendary Pokemon in competitive battles, how do they get the ideal IVs? Since you can't breed them how is it possible to get one with a good nature and IV spread? Do people mostly focus for a good nature or do they soft reset? I literally have no clue how people do this, but there are so many Legendaries floating about!
Thanks for all of your help so far ;; You have no idea how useful it is to actually talk this stuff through with someone. When I Google things it just seems that every says different stuff (which is understandable as you can try things in so many different ways, but it makes deciding things an awful lot harder!).
-
You're currently a little weak to fighting with no (meaningful) resists. That is to say, Talonflame can't really count because it can't take a resisted hit very well anyway, so it can't always switch in to fighting moves. Also kinda grass weak, although Talonflames 4x resist does count for quite a lot there.
These taken into account, may I suggest Aegislash? Being immune to fighting and resisting grass will be useful, whilst it is only weak to Fire (covered by Every member), Ground (covered by Talonflame, but magnified by TTar, so want another resist in last slot), Dark & Ghost (both resisted by TTar and Greninja). For him, the best set I find is:
Aegislash @ Leftovers
252 HP / 252 SpA / 4 Atk
Quiet Nature
-> Shadow Ball
-> Shadow Sneak
-> Sacred Sword / Flash Cannon
-> King's Shield
Then, for your last slot, you'd be wanting a ground resist/immunity, which I would usually suggest in Rotom-W, but as you've already said you'd rather not, I might suggest Latio/as. This adds unwanted Dark, Ghost, Ice, Dragon & Fairy weaknesses, but that's nothing Aegislash and TTar can't handle between them, but it gives you amazing power if Latios, and an oppurtunity to get rid of stealth rock if you use defog. I'd recommend Latios out of the two, but latias is acceptable if you want bulk. Anyways, for Latios I'd recommend:
Latios @ Life Orb
Timid Nature
252 SpA / 252 Speed / 4 HP
-> Draco Meteor
-> Psyshock
-> HP Fire / Surf / Thunderbolt / Defog
-> HP Fire / Surf / Thunderbolt / Defog
~~~
Just a few suggestions, don't feel like they're completely right or anything, because there is no right (although there is a wrong xD), but it's just what I'd fill the last two in with.
-
Fair enough, Nidoking and Garchomp are both Ground type, so I can see the potential for trouble there. Yeah, Nidoking isn't the best in OU anyway, so ditching him isn't a big deal. With the way your team is offensively oriented right now, I'd suggest things like Bisharp, Mega Mawile, Aegislash, Latios, Landorus-Genie, Deoxys-Speed, Mega Pinsir (though somewhat redundant alongside Talonflame, the two can actually make a deadly pair to remove the Flying resistances and just wreck their way through), Dragonite, Azumarill, Specs Rotom-Wash, all are great choices.
In response to legendaries - many are either RNG'd or PokeGen'd by people. As long as PokeTransfer allows them through (which it won't if there's anything they wouldn't be able to have), they're completely legal. Cloning is also possible in X/Y through an easy trade glitch with no risk if you're doing things correctly, so there are plenty of legendaries floating around!
And I'm happy to help, really! I know how daunting it can be to get into the competitive scene, so anything I can do to help is my pleasure! :) (Also, sorry about the delayed response... Mario Kart 8 happened xD)
*Sniped by Dick... 2 hours ago*
-
Then, for your last slot, you'd be wanting a ground resist/immunity, which I would usually suggest in Rotom-W, but as you've already said you'd rather not, I might suggest Latio/as. This adds unwanted Dark, Ghost, Ice, Dragon & Fairy weaknesses, but that's nothing Aegislash and TTar can't handle between them, but it gives you amazing power if Latios, and an oppurtunity to get rid of stealth rock if you use defog. I'd recommend Latios out of the two, but latias is acceptable if you want bulk. Anyways, for Latios I'd recommend:
Latios @ Life Orb
Timid Nature
252 SpA / 252 Speed / 4 HP
-> Draco Meteor
-> Psyshock
-> HP Fire / Surf / Thunderbolt / Defog
-> HP Fire / Surf / Thunderbolt / Defog
I quite like the sound of Latios :) I'll just have to see how to get my hands on one of them! xD
Fair enough, Nidoking and Garchomp are both Ground type, so I can see the potential for trouble there. Yeah, Nidoking isn't the best in OU anyway, so ditching him isn't a big deal. With the way your team is offensively oriented right now, I'd suggest things like Bisharp, Mega Mawile, Aegislash, Latios, Landorus-Genie, Deoxys-Speed, Mega Pinsir (though somewhat redundant alongside Talonflame, the two can actually make a deadly pair to remove the Flying resistances and just wreck their way through), Dragonite, Azumarill, Specs Rotom-Wash, all are great choices.
In response to legendaries - many are either RNG'd or PokeGen'd by people. As long as PokeTransfer allows them through (which it won't if there's anything they wouldn't be able to have), they're completely legal. Cloning is also possible in X/Y through an easy trade glitch with no risk if you're doing things correctly, so there are plenty of legendaries floating around!
And I'm happy to help, really! I know how daunting it can be to get into the competitive scene, so anything I can do to help is my pleasure! :) (Also, sorry about the delayed response... Mario Kart 8 happened xD)
*Sniped by Dick... 2 hours ago*
I'm loving the suggestions xD Dragonite and Azumarill are two of the top Pokemon I wanted to train competitively, so if they fit with what we've spoken about so far I'd be pretty chuffed! I'm a real sucker for using Pokemon that I actually like xD Mawile is quite a cool idea too.
As for the legendaries, I suppose that makes sense. I'll just have to trade for one, I suppose :) I'll have to think about this in more depth tomorrow when I'm a little more awake. I'm pretty excited to get a new team up and running!
-
*I hope this doesn't count as spam since I'm posting again*
I've had a look in a bit more detail at possible team members and used a calculator to try to see if I have decent type coverage at the very least. So far I quite like the look of the following:
Dragonite
Garchomp
Gregninja
Azumaril
Talonflame
Gengar (I also considered Mawile and Ferrothorn too. I don't like Ferrothorn but those spikes >> I'd quite like a 'mon that can set up an entry hazard. Other suggestions that jump to mind are most welcome)
General thoughts? I know I need to specify natures and what each will be doing, but right now I'm just taking it one step at a time ;; I'd like to keep at least Dragonite or Garchomp if I need to choose one to base my team around.
-
I'm kinda curious, if you decide to keep garchomp, what will you use as its moveset?
-
I think I'd try out the Choice Band set that Richard posted up, so:
Garchomp@ Choice Band
Rough Skin
Jolly nature (+Speed, -Sp. Attack)
EVs: 252 Attack / 252 Speed / 4 HP
Outrage
Earthquake
Dragon Claw / Dual Chop
Fire Fang / Aqua Tail / Stone Edge
-
Well, if that doesn't work, I run:
Jolly @Leftovers
Dragon Claw
EQ
Substitute
SD
252 Attack
252 Speed
4 HP
It works surprisingly good.
-
I see, well since it's pretty similar I might test them both out :D Thanks for the advice!
-
As your team appears to be taking on a hyper offensive shape, here are some things to consider:
Bisharp deters opponents from laying Sticky Web. If it doesn't, your opponent is giving Bisharp a free doubled Attack boost every time it enters the battle. With Sucker Punch, the Speed drop is insignificant. Pursuit allows you to trap Latios as well. I've been running a Latios counter set:
Bisharp@ Assault Vest
{Defiant}
Adamant nature (+Attack, -Sp. Attack)
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Attack / 4 Sp. Defense
Sucker Punch
Pursuit
Knock Off
Iron Head
Sucker Punch bypasses Bisharp's low Speed, while Pursuit traps things like Latios that have already used Draco Meteor. Knock Off is your safest STAB, not relying on the opponent to attack or switch to be used properly, and it's also your strongest STAB attack, jumping to 97.5 base power when the opponent is holding an item, while also removing that item. Iron Head covers most things that resist Dark.
If you're not worried about Latios, change Assault Vest to Life Orb and max the Speed.
Aegislash@ Weakness Policy
{Stance Change}
Brave nature (+Attack, -Speed)
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Attack / 4 Defense
Swords Dance
Shadow Sneak
Iron Head
Sacred Sword
SD on an opponent with a Super Effective attack, and sweep with Shadow Sneak. Iron Head and Sacred Sword are mostly for coverage. Iron Head can be removed for King's Shield if you're so inclined.
Keldeo@ Choice Specs
{Justified}
Timid nature (+Speed, -Attack)
EVs: 252 Sp. Attack / 252 Speed / 4 HP
Hydro Pump
Secret Sword
Icy Wind
Scald
While this can be hard to obtain in-game, Specs Keldeo is a powerful threat in OU. Hydro Pump is your strongest STAB attack, and punched holes into even resistant Pokemon. Secret Sword is awesome, dealing physical damage off Keldeo's Sp. Attack stat, making Blissey and other special walls a non-option in terms of countering Keldeo. Icy Wind hits thinks like Dragonite, Latios, Garchomp, etc. Finally, Scald is your best option for dealing with Mega Venusaur switch-ins. If M-Venu is burnt, it loses its status as a Keldeo counter. If not, M-Venusaur hard counters Keldeo, though it still takes a lot from Hydro Pump.
Those are just a few things to consider. :)
-
Hello again :)
I actually ran into an Aegislash like that today and it was a demon!
I've been practicing using the following team on Pokemon Showdown today (I don't want to waste time breeding and training a team that might not work when I come down to using it so this is my first step!).
Greninja
Nature: Timid
Ability: Protean
Item: Life Orb
Moves: Spikes, U-Turn, Hydro Pump, Ice Beam.
EV Spread: Sp.Atk, Speed (4 in Defense)
Talonflame
Nature: Adamant
Ability: Gale Wings
Item: Choice Band
Moves: U-Turn, Brave Bird, Flare Blitz, Will-O-Whisp
EV Spread: Attack, Speed (4 in Defense)
Garchomp
Nature: Jolly
Ability: Rough Skin
Item: Choice Scarf
Moves: Outrage, Earthquake, Dual Chop, Stone Edge
EV Spread: Speed, Attack (4 in HP)
Azumarill
Nature: Adamant
Ability: Huge Power
Item: Leftovers
Moves: Substitute, Aqua Jet, Focus Punch, Play Rough
EV Spread: HP, Defense (4 in Attack)
Dragonite
Nature: Careful
Ability: Multiscale
Item: (Leftovers is ideal but I only have one on my game, any other suggestions?)
Moves: Wrap, Toxic, Roost, Earthquake
EV Spread: HP, Sp.Def (4 in Defense).
Gengar
Nature: Timid
Ability: Shadow Tag
Item: Gengarite
Moves: Thunderbolt, Sludge Wave, Shadow Ball, Destiny Bond
EV Spread: Sp. Atk, Speed. (4 in HP)
So far it's working quite nicely, although Talonflame and Garchomp have yet to have had their moments to shine in my opinion ^^ I need to work out what item to give Dragonite though, so help would be appreciated there along with any other comments about my revised competitive team :) As always, thanks for all the help so far!
-
Swap to Naive nature on Greninja with the 4 in Attack. It'll make U-Turn more powerful and Greninja's defenses are too horrible to take a hit anyway.
Azumarill - While this set isn't really bad, it loses to the most common Azumarill counter: Mega Venusaur. I'd suggest Choice Band with Waterfall, Play Rough, Aqua Jet, Superpower / Ice Punch / Return. Belly Drum is an option, but requires enough Speed to outspeed Mega Venusaur for the OHKO, and you lose a lot of bulk that way, so I'd stick with Choice Band with max HP and Attack.
Dragonite's set here is honestly awful. Wrap is garbage. On your offensively oriented team, this sticks out as a huge sore thumb that could be doing so much more. I'd recommend this:
Dragonite@ Weakness Policy
{Multiscale}
Adamant nature (+Attack, -Sp. Attack)
EVs: 252 Attack / 252 Speed / 4 Defense
Dragon Dance
Dragon Claw
Earthquake
Fire Punch / ExtremeSpeed / Roost
Standard DD set, with Weakness Policy. DD once and hopefully take a Super Effective attack to activate WP. Multiscale, if intact, makes this much easier. At +3, Dragon Claw is going to rip through most things that don't resist. Earthquake and Fire Punch deal with everything that resists Dragon. ExtremeSpeed is an option in the last slot to beat out opposing priority users or faster Scarfers. Roost is an option here to remove your Flying type for the turn if you move first, to restore 50% of your health, and to possible re-activate Multiscale.
Gengar - Gengarite is banned in OU, and therefore cannot be used. Life Orb on this.
-
I've been practicing using the following team on Pokemon Showdown today (I don't want to waste time breeding and training a team that might not work when I come down to using it so this is my first step!)
Really? Then we'll have to set up a battle sometime so I can see how it's coming.
-
Always run Weakness Policy on Dragonite and Tyranitar. Mainly because they have the bulk to withstand a super effective hit. Same with Aegislash if you decided to use one of those. Also, what I have found to help me the most if a few priority moves. Here is my current team..
Honchkrow
Nautre/Ability: Adamant ~ Moxie
Item: Lum Berry (for prankster or speedy will-o-wisps)
EVs: 252 HP/ATK 4 Speed
Sucker Punch (good priority against Aegislash, even with his bulk, it still does a lot of damage)
Brave Bird
Pursuit (for when you know the guys are going to withdraw, catch them before they swap)
Roost
Meganium
Nature/Ability: Bold ~ Overgrow
Item: Leftovers
EVs: 252 HP/DEF 4 SAtk
Leech Seed
Energy Ball
Synthesis
Reflect
The goal with him is to set up the reflect or leech seed first turn depending on the opponent. He does not have the most bulk, but he is so useful. He has single-handedly won me a lot of matches because he is so bulky with reflect up. The reason I don't run Giga Drain is because he cannot learn it in Gen 6. Which doesn't make any sense to me..
Banette
Nature/Ability: Adamant ~ Frisk/Prankster
Item: Banettite
EVs: 252 HP/ATK 4 DEF
Shadow Sneak
Destiny Bond (Breed with a Gengar)
Will-o-Wisp
Knock Off
The main point of Banette is to try and force someone out if you manage to catch a banded Normal/Fighting user, this is even better. Although he doesn't have much bulk, using him with Meganiums reflect helps a lot on swapping him in. Once he gets prankster, either Destiny Bond to get rid of a huge threat, or just burn them if you can manage to tank 2 of the hits. My Banette has taken down Garchomps that I have burnt + had reflect up. He is basically a suicide Poke though.
Rotom-W
Nature/Ability: Bold ~ Levitate
Item: Sitrus Berry
EVs: 252 HP/DEF
Hydro Pump
Thunderbolt
Volt Switch
Will-o-Wisp
For when you can't get Banette in safely, it is always nice to have a back up burner. Since he has such a solid typing, you can pretty much swap him into any hit and he will tank it well. Even if it hits a little more than half the first turn, once you eat the Sitrus you should be able to take 2 and at the very least get a Will-o-Wisp off to help out the rest of the team.
Meowstic-F
Nature/Ability: Timid ~ Competitive
Item: Choice Specs
EVs: 252 SAtk/Speed 4 HP
Thunderbolt
Energy Ball
Dark Pulse
Psyshock
Although I have covered a lot of those moves already with previous Pokemon, it is nice to have a speedy late game sweep with some neutral moves on the remaining Pokemon. I have had some good success with Meowstic-F. Especially if they have an Intimidator on their team.
Jolteon
Nature/Ability: Timid ~ Volt Absorb
Item: Air Balloon
EVs: 252 SAtk/Speed 4 HP
Hidden Power (Ice) This is tricky to get when breeding for Kalos. Gotta make sure you are lacking in ATK/DEF to get it.
Shadow Ball
Thunderbolt
Volt Switch
Jolteon is very very fast, with a Timid nature and the investment, he has around 200 base Speed. He is a solid lead if facing a Greninja lead because he outspeeds by 7 or so. If you are going to lead with it, you should Volt Switch out. So if the Greninja is sashed, you can swap into something that will tank the hit from the Greninja better than frail Jolteon would. Another good alternative to holding the Balloon would be a Life Orb.
The entire moral to this team is to keep momentum with the volt switching and bulk. If you get caught by a Garchomp or something, a HP Ice will likely one shot it. You lack in some areas when it comes to facing a Ferrothorn or something, but when it comes to Battle Spot, it should be pretty helpful. The Pokemon that I would be most prone to switch would be Meowstic. If I do swap him out, I would choose Houndoom or something that could cover Fire/Dark. If you're planning on running a team for a 6v6, the main goal to it is to keep momentum the entire match. Even if you can't use Volt Switch, after 1 or 2 of the turns of them swapping on it, you should be able to predict it the next time you send him out and can catch them.
-
^That team has quite a few major issues, if I'm honest.
Meganium, as much as I love it's design, is awful. It's outclassed by nearly every other grass type in the game, and in OU something like Ferrothorn, M-Venusaur or Whimsicott is more viable, particularly the latter for what your team was attempting.
Mega Banette is one of the poorest megas, too, unfortunately. Using a suicide mon as your mega is not the best idea when something like Gengar is going to do a similar job.
About Meowstic - why not Alkazam? It's stronger and faster. Doesn't have competitive, but that's useful very rarely and otherwise Alakazam is just... Better.
Basically... That team is better of dropping Rotom-W and just being an RU team
-
Going to have to agree with Dick here... posting your team here is very off-topic and counter-productive to what we've been building for Nellie's team, which has taken a focus to Hyper Offense. If you'd like to post your team, you'd be better off posting it in its own thread.
-
Although the team seems rough, I definitely do think that your suggestions are better. But you'd be shocked how hard it is to kill Meganium when he is played well. He has single handedly won me a lot of games because of the DEF investment and Reflect combo. I use the Rotom-W in combo with the Meganium because they counter each others weaknesses.
The Mega Banette isn't totally a suicide Poke though. With his pretty good ATK stat, fully invested, I definitely like using the Destiny Bond as a final resort. It's usually for Pokemon that I can't kill like Ferrothorn or Venusaur. So it is definitely useful when it needs to be. Since he does get Prankster, he also can Will-o which makes a lot of physical sweepers useless with the Reflect combo. The team has a lot of synergy.
But the Meowstic I made just for fun, and I was trying to incorporate it into a team, but it's just really not good. I am trying to find something for a solid 6th. But yeh, I just usually use lower tiered guys and they could work if you really want them to. It's a little more fun to me that way.
-
Post your team in its own thread in Team Building if you'd like us to talk further about it, as this topic is not about your team. I actually have a lot to say about your team, but this is not the appropriate topic to do so. I encourage you to do so, because I could help you out a lot.
About the topic at hand, her team isn't focused on momentum, it's a heavy offense style team that intends to break walls through sheer force and repeated heavy hits. It's a different playstyle, and not one I use that often, but it's a valid playstyle if the team is built around it and the player is aware of how to play it.
-
I've been testing out the team with the changes you suggested and overall it's going pretty well. I have noticed that I've been struggling a little with Skarmory, Ferrothorn and Mega Venusaur though. How do you suggest I tackle these demons? Once Stealth Rocks are up my Talonflame can't really take them :/
-
TBH, is SR is up, Talonflame had better be out when they're being set, you should have a defogger, or Talonflame should be fainted by now. Roost will help, but using it as soon as you come out will make you lose a turn and either let them switch into a counter or set up and scare you out, leading to more SR damage.
Here's a thought, why not switch U turn and spikes to HP fire and Extrasensory on greninja? That may leave you unable to switch, but that will let you remain in on those threats, although mega venusaur will require prior damage from other pokemon...... If you go with my suggestion, switch back to Timid and put that 4 in SpD or Def.
Rich, does this sound good to you?
-
Sounds like a good suggestion to me. Spikes on Greninja isn't something I'd recommend anyway, it's too frail to setup Spikes. If Talonflame's weakness to SR is too much to handle, you can switch to Staraptor:
Staraptor@ Life Orb
{Reckless}
Jolly nature (+Speed, -Sp. Attack)
EVs: 252 Attack / 252 Speed / 4 Defense
Brave Bird
Double-Edge
Close Combat
U-Turn / Roost
Staraptor's a good replacement for Talonflame in OU that doesn't suffer as many of the problems as Talonflame does, and it's actually stronger, though not as fast. Brave Bird and Double-Edge are your STABs, and both are boosted by Reckless. Close Combat deals with things resistant to Flying and Normal, like Tyranitar and Heatran. U-Turn allows you to escape from any bad matchups while dealing damage (though also chipping 10% from yourself, so be sure it's worth it), while Roost can give you a chance to heal from the copious amount of damage you'll be dealing to yourself from your STABs and from Stealth Rock. Ideally, this is done on the switch, as Staraptor's defenses won't allow for it to take a hit.
Skarmory itself doesn't have an offensive presence outside of Brave Bird, so it's more a matter of the entry hazards it lays being annoying. Having a Rapid Spinner or Defogger makes Skarmory useless and non-threatening.