Topic: JUNE COROCORO LEAKS (EVEN MORE NEW POKEMON)

[quack98]

Yeah, but I doubt they'd hype about a new type being strong to dragon and then give it crippling weaknesses...

I hope it's weak to poison & steel, and preferably to rock.

I think there may be a two-way thing with Fairy SE on dark, and Dark SE on Fairy, mainly because of the legendary duo, and it makes sense.

Yeah, Exo-Uber tier was more Hyperbole than anything else  I know we won't see a tier above that... (Unless deoxys-A gets pure power...)

[Richard and Blaziken]

If they're bringing in a new type with the strict reasoning of balance, I think they'll give it a good balance of strengths and weaknesses, so as not to over-centralize the metagame while still providing a nice sense of balance that we've needed. Like I said though, it's too early to panic about things we don't fully know yet.

[Specstile]

unova has made me sick to death with dragons.
I hope it is immunity but it will probably just be not very effective or neutral

[.~:Sly Foxx:~.]

I think my main problem with them being immune is that Marill will be immune to Salamence launching a meteor from space... Erm... I fail to see the logic...

You get these problems with all sorts of Pokemon though. Why should a Marowak's Bonemerang not hurt a little Pidgey? Why should normal type Pokemon be incapable of being licked and astonished? The list goes on...

[quack98]

Bonemarang shouldn't really be ground type tbh, it's a thrown weapon, nothing to do with the ground, it's not a flaw with type matchup, just a flaw with move classification.

Astonish doesn't work on normal types because they aren't aware of the ghosts presence, and it's hard to astonish someone who doesn't know you're there

Lick is odd though, I would've put that in Poison or Normal myself, because I don't see how it's ghost...

The main problem with Dragon being ineffective against something is the power of the moves. How can anything be immune to:
-> Roar of time
-> Spacial Rend
-> Draco Meteor
-> Twister
Even Outrage to an extent?

I'm not saying it couldn't happen, it just seems more like a resistance would make more sense.


On a side note; I would laugh so much if GF pulled the ultimate troll move and said fairy doesn't effect flying...

[Lord Raven]

I think my main problem with them being immune is that Marill will be immune to Salamence launching a meteor from space... Erm... I fail to see the logic...

gastly can learn ice punch soooooo your argument is invalid


also "hot skitty on wailord action" but you're 15 so i think you're too young to know the context behind that (considering you were like 5-6 when RS came out)

[quack98]

gastly can learn ice punch soooooo your argument is invalid


also "hot skitty on wailord action" but you're 15 so i think you're too young to know the context behind that (considering you were like 5-6 when RS came out)

Actually, Ruby was my first game. And I got it near release. But yeah, breeding really doesn't make sense...

As for gastly learning ice punch; that's plain stupid...

[f3raligatr]

No. Dragons need a nerf more than anything else in the game, it's ridiculous. I think people are just upset that they won't be able to spam Draco Meteor/Outrage as much anymore, if Fairy is indeed resistant/immune to Dragon, which it well should be. They're also probably not going to retcon any past types to now be SE to Dragon, that makes no sense.

This is perhaps one of the few things I think we may disagree on here mate.

I'll admit I'm probably bias as Dragons are one of my favourite Pokémon types, but..

Isn't the entire point of the Dragon type is that they are overpowered? They're meant to be the mythical, overstrengthed creatures that our own mythologies portray them as, supposedly powerful and wise whilst being relatively hard to beat or match. Even in other media, the strongest bosses in a lot of fantasy games are in fact Dragons. That's presumeably why the majority of Dragon types (I'm pretending you don't exist Altaria) are very powerful by their base stats, as well as the Dragon type being Super Effective against itself.

I don't think it's so much about being unable to spam Draco Meteor and Outrage, it's more about a slight loss in identity (in a sense..) for the Dragon type, especially if the Fairy type is immune to their attacks. I don't think they'll retcon any past types either, only those that involve the Fairy type as expected, but it'd be disappointed if they did just to nerf a type that's meant to be overpowered anyway.

[quack98]

^I agree with this, why shouldn't Dragons be a little OP? They take ages to evolve, and their base stats are high; because GF intended them to be the elite type. This is also why Dragons are normally the 8th gym, or in the elite four. (Or in Johto games, the Champion as well as 8th Gym).

Even Altaria, which (as much as I love it) is probably the weakest dragon, is still pretty strong (490 BST for the weakest of a type).

They do need a small nerf, mainly because outrage spam is a little boring, but they should still be the best type, if only by a little bit.

[Turner]

I'm not sure how many of you have seen the Japanese eShop trailer...but here it is:

Clicky

Looks like Fennekin has a punching move... 'Glow Punch'.


Also regarding Fairy type and Dragons, in mythology Fairies have owned Dragons as pets, Dragons are the creatures and Fairies are the owners. Obviously seems a little weird when you have Pokemon like Marril as Fairy-type but it's still true regardless.

[Lord Raven]

Isn't the entire point of the Dragon type is that they are overpowered? They're meant to be the mythical, overstrengthed creatures that our own mythologies portray them as, supposedly powerful and wise whilst being relatively hard to beat or match. Even in other media, the strongest bosses in a lot of fantasy games are in fact Dragons. That's presumeably why the majority of Dragon types (I'm pretending you don't exist Altaria) are very powerful by their base stats, as well as the Dragon type being Super Effective against itself.

I hardly think adding some Pokemon of a new type will cause an extreme nerf to dragons.  It just makes them a little bit more fallible than they use to be.

Looks like Fennekin has a punching move... 'Glow Punch'.

I'm confident it's a psychic type punching move

[quack98]

Also regarding Fairy type and Dragons, in mythology Fairies have owned Dragons as pets, Dragons are the creatures and Fairies are the owners. Obviously seems a little weird when you have Pokemon like Marril as Fairy-type but it's still true regardless.

This may be true, but it's also true that in most mythology, Dragons are impervious to magic (which seems to be what Fairy type is akin to).

But anyway, I kind of wish it was called 'Faery' type, mainly because Fairy sounds more like pixies and stuff, whereas Faery is more associated with folklore. More of a personal preference, really.

[Richard and Blaziken]

The thing is, they're introducing Fairy type to balance the types, as they themselves have stated. From an objective standpoint, sure, maybe Dragons should be OP, but from a competitive standpoint, I think the fact that 4Drag2Mag is a thing that exists, speaks for itself.

As Muhed stated, this probably won't be an extreme nerf to Dragons anyway. They still hit 15/18 types neutrally, 1 SE, and only 1/2 resists and 1/0 immune, depending on how Fairy is effected by Dragon. Dragons, no matter how cool they may be, should not rule the metagame with an iron fist, if we want a more healthy competitive atmosphere.

About Dragon being the "best type", that's somewhat debatable. Sure, they have all the coverage as I just mentioned, but the best type, at least in terms of competitive battling, depends on the metagame. I'd argue that Fighting is the "best type" of 5th gen, though the Therian genies helped fix this a bit.

[quack98]

Maybe best type wasnt the right wording... I meant as in they should be viewed as the best type, not nessasarily from a competitive viewpoint, but from the primary market (3-10 yo is probably fair to say that's the primary market)

In other words, ingame they should be overpowered (about to the point they are now, I obviously don't mean more OP  ) but they need a little balance competitively, that's why I think it should be a resistance rather than immunity anyway, it's a fair balance.

[Turner]

The great thing about the fairy balance isn't just that Dragon needed a nerf, it's that when playing through the game, Dragon always felt like a shoehorned type.

You barely see it through the game at all (not even wild) until you're up against the last few gyms/E4. Meaning you have to find and raise a dragon type from wild to get them up to the level of all your other Pokemon. It never felt quite smooth and it always bugged me that you only got a choice of a small handful of Dragon types, if you didn't like them then you were screwed and had to hope there was an Ice type you liked somewhere or else it was going to be uphill all the way.

It'd be nice to see a champion that uses ghost types or psychic or something. The games have always treated dragons like some all-powerful pseudo-legendary beasts you only see right near the end, I'm glad they're getting a balance.