Author Topic: What do you think of Smash 4?  (Read 8720 times)

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Offline Lord Raven

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Re: What do you think of Smash 4?
« Reply #135 on: December 28, 2015, 21:33 »
I think Super Mario RPG is much more obscure than Fire Emblem at this point.

Roy appeals to the Melee players (as does Mewtwo) and he was a fan favorite if only for that Flade Blade move and all the random pyrotechnics..  Ike was relevant in 2007 when Radiant Dawn came out and people loved him in Brawl.  Marth is a veteran and had a pretty heavy level of involvement in Awakening with Lucina/Robin.  Corrine will be released basically with his/her game, and he also looks way different than all the other guys.

Marth/Lucina are all too similar and I agree that Lucina did not deserve much of a place in this game (but she was also the best advertisement for FE13, because FE fans were wetting themselves with this idea of this mysterious Marth person in FE13, so it makes sense from that perspective) but Roy is far different from these two.  5 of the 6 FE characters are distinct from one another, so we're also getting another unique fighter.

There's also not many characters that are more relevant to newer games than Corrine.  Maybe like Toad...  Although, I'll put out there that FE Fans are pissed about Corrine being in it, so I'm pretty unique in looking forward to him/her.

Someone put forward the theory that Cloud was voted in by Japan (or America), Bayonetta by Europe, and Corrine was put in because Americans kept trying to vote in Goku or Shrek or some stupid crap.  I mean they did it ironically, but I think they were like "screw all this, we'll just put in an FE character cause their game is released in February in the states."  I mean, 15 years later and nobody in Japan's complaining about Roy in Melee despite Melee coming out before FE6.
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Offline Clairefable

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Re: What do you think of Smash 4?
« Reply #136 on: December 28, 2015, 22:00 »
I think Super Mario RPG is much more obscure than Fire Emblem at this point.

I'm sure it is, but so what? Punch Out, Mother and Duck Hunt probably are as well. I'm just using Geno as an example; Nintendo have a wealth of IPs they can draw inspiration from. I get that Nintendo are obviously trying to promote FE but we already have three characters introduced in Sm4sh alone. Is that number going to continue to rise when Smash 5 comes along? In comparison, there are "only" nine Mario characters in Sm4sh (ten if you count the Koopa kids), which is the series upon which Nintendo was pretty much built so naturally will be heavily represented. Compared to other series, the ratio of FE characters just seems a little skewed.

My perspective on that one is probably a little biased when everyone knows that Mario is my most favourite games series of all time, but it's also arguably the most famous.

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I mean, 15 years later and nobody in Japan's complaining about Roy in Melee despite Melee coming out before FE6.

I'm sure they would be if there were already five other FE characters in the games already at that point.

I don't have an issue with the characters themselves (Roy's MY boy), I guess I was just hoping for something a little more... unexpected? I'm not even going to pretend I wouldn't love Goku in Sm4sh. The internet is crying out for Ridley. I would love to see Skyward Sword Impa, or Kumatora from Mother 3. It was just a bit disappointing to have what looked to be more of the same I suppose. But I will reserve final judgement until the character is released... Corin/ne would well be a new favourite!

Offline Lord Raven

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Re: What do you think of Smash 4?
« Reply #137 on: December 28, 2015, 22:14 »
I'm sure it is, but so what? Punch Out, Mother and Duck Hunt probably are as well.
I don't know about Duck Hunt but Punch Out was re-released for the Wii somewhat and I think it sold well.  I guess Little Mac was also someone they could make unique.

Ness is a mainstay from the original and Lucas is a favorite from Brawl.

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I'm just using Geno as an example; Nintendo have a wealth of IPs they can draw inspiration from. I get that Nintendo are obviously trying to promote FE but we already have three characters introduced in Sm4sh alone. Is that number going to continue to rise when Smash 5 comes along? In comparison, there are "only" nine Mario characters in Sm4sh (ten if you count the Koopa kids), which is the series upon which Nintendo was pretty much built so naturally will be heavily represented. Compared to other series, the ratio of FE characters just seems a little skewed.
Yes, but are there many other Mario characters to choose from?  What about Zelda?  Wolf Link is the only other Zelda character I can think of that people would buy, Toad is the only other Mario character.  I don't think that many people played Super Mario RPG and it's also a game from the 90s that didn't really see anything in Melee.  Truth be told I think Melee was just about where Geno's window had passed.  Smash is part advertising in the end.

Contrast to Mother 3 which came out in 2006 in Japan.  I also wouldn't be surprised if there was some lobbying from IS to put in Corrine as DLC.

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I'm sure they would be if there were already five other FE characters in the games already at that point.
For Roy?  No. For Corrine, it partly makes sense because people aren't liking what they hear about Fates, because apparently Corrine is very Mary/Marty Stu-ish.

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I don't have an issue with the characters themselves (Roy's MY boy), I guess I was just hoping for something a little more... unexpected? I'm not even going to pretend I wouldn't love Goku in Sm4sh. The internet is crying out for Ridley. I would love to see Skyward Sword Impa, or Kumatora from Mother 3. It was just a bit disappointing to have what looked to be more of the same I suppose. But I will reserve final judgement until the character is released... Corin/ne would well be a new favourite!
I don't think Goku would fit in with the cast myself (besides doesn't Ryu have a Goku uniform anyway, come on ppl use ur imagination).  I don't think they could make Ridley really fit. Skyward Sword Impa would work but I don't know how different it would be from Sheik.  I think Lucas only got clamoring in the end because of his appearance in Brawl, so I don't think a Mother franchise would work here either.

Though truth be told, it's Lucina I personally have an issue with when all is said and done, the other 5 are fine.

I think they should've updated with costumes somehow.  Not like some five dollar DLC cause I really don't want to deal with that nonsense but you know, stuff like Ike with his Vanguard uniform, maybe give Sheik a SS Impa costume, etc.  I mean, we have like 6 different Koopalings, two different Robins (and Corrines by extension), two different Clouds, two different Olimars, etc.
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Offline SirBlaziken

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Re: What do you think of Smash 4?
« Reply #138 on: December 28, 2015, 22:44 »
Quite honestly, if they take 4 of Marth's costumes and pulled a Robin with Lucina, i'd be cool with it (as long as the yellow costume is one of the 4 that stays).

Either way, I'm really enjoying Cloud and i'm likely going to stop using Marth as much as I usually do and pick Cloud up in his place. Fox is still my top spot.

That leaves Fox and Cloud as mains with Marth, ZSS and Lucario as sides.
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Offline Lord Raven

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Re: What do you think of Smash 4?
« Reply #139 on: December 28, 2015, 22:47 »
Ditto with Pit and Dark Pit.
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Offline SirBlaziken

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Re: What do you think of Smash 4?
« Reply #140 on: December 28, 2015, 23:02 »
The pits actually do play slightly differently to be honest.

Wait a sec, there's two pits? Better nerf greninja.  :laugh:

But seriously, greninja has been nerfed to hell and back. At least mewtwo got buffed up and can finally kill things with its up air, and the hitboxes finally got less broken (in the bad sense, not the godly good sense).
« Last Edit: December 28, 2015, 23:13 by Breaking Blaziken »
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Offline Lord Raven

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Re: What do you think of Smash 4?
« Reply #141 on: December 28, 2015, 23:24 »
Pit and Dark Pit only different in their ftilts and their specials.  Lucina and Marth differ in sword sweet spots.  Lucina and Marth are much more different than Pit and Dark Pit.

Also, Mario/Dr. Mario should've been that way too, although they have a bunch of other differences in what their moves do.
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Offline SirBlaziken

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Re: What do you think of Smash 4?
« Reply #142 on: December 28, 2015, 23:28 »
I see what you mean with that. I mean Dr. Mario and Mario are both pretty different. One can recover and the other has a PhD.
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Offline Lord Raven

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Re: What do you think of Smash 4?
« Reply #143 on: December 29, 2015, 00:00 »
dr mario is a doctor of medicine, not philosophy
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Offline SirBlaziken

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Re: What do you think of Smash 4?
« Reply #144 on: December 29, 2015, 00:04 »
I suppose you would know about that, I mean you are working towards that sort of thing.

What are your thoughts on Cloud?
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Offline Richard and Blaziken

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Re: What do you think of Smash 4?
« Reply #145 on: January 30, 2016, 00:55 »
Cloud's pretty good, but his recovery is so bad that I just play him the same way as I play Little Mac; wait for his approach, throw him off stage, and gimp him.

Cloud is much better than Mac, of course, and has a ton of potential, but I think his potential to be gimped is too bad to allow him to be a top tier. Still a character to be prepared for.
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Offline SirBlaziken

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Re: What do you think of Smash 4?
« Reply #146 on: January 30, 2016, 01:08 »
Meanwhile back in Ohio, after playing a bit of Ike with my friend, I get over my delusion of Cloud's killing power. He can't kill well, and I can't play rushdown like I do with Fox, so yeah. Still using both. Plus my ds broke so I couldn't practice for a month until my friend got me a gamecube adapter for an early birthday present. Either way, I was will better off than greninja.

So in conclusion, fox and cloud are both lightish, one can combo and kill, the other knocks away, and I still lose to an air fighting little mac. Yes, you read that right. This is what happens when i'm rusty, and never fight a little mac. Still pathetic.
« Last Edit: January 30, 2016, 01:12 by SirBlaziken »
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Offline Richard and Blaziken

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Re: What do you think of Smash 4?
« Reply #147 on: February 04, 2016, 07:14 »
Bayonetta and Corrin are out today!

After spending 5 hours play-testing with a friend that does competitive Smash, Corrin is actually really scary. The lance into the ground gives them so many options.

Bayonetta seems complicated, it's really hard to determine how good she is at the moment. I feel like it'll be a Ryu situation where no one knows how good they are until someone masters them and starts dominating with them (Trela), so we'll see.
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Re: What do you think of Smash 4?
« Reply #148 on: February 05, 2016, 02:38 »
Here is my initial analysis of both characters. Please note that I haven't been able to play either of them due to the lack of money.

Corrin

Finally, a character with a decentish counter. As said before, the lance gives Corrin many options to follow up and almost provides a mix-up game for him (or her if you're using Corrine). The attacks are strong and the novelty of being part dragon is very cool in my opinion. Something that intrigues me is the standard special mouth cannon. The projectile paralyzes, but up close, the dragon mouth can do damage and even KO. That will be fun to play around with. If there is one thing that concerns me, it's that from what I have seen that the up special isn't great for recovery, so recovering as Corrin may be a tad more difficult that you would expect. I dunno, I could be wrong. Corrin will have a mid tier absolute basement in my opinion and easily be the best option from the Fire Emblem series if you're looking for something tiered a little higher.

Bayonetta

Now here's where things can get a bit hairy (get it?). Bayonetta seems like a character that will require precise timing (wow, there's another) and will be heavily combo based, a lot like what Ryu requires. She will have an extreme learning curve and is not for the faint of heart or for those with very little patience. Witch Time if used right will be better than any mere counter (looking at you Corrin), as it will allow you to basically get a free combo. No one will know how to use her until some steps up, puts in the hours and then turns around and murders most of the competition with her (as Trela did with Ryu. Hell, he had Nairo on the ropes in a 2-1 count before losing the next two to his ZSS). Then people will realize how great of a character she is and main her in droves. Something tells me that she will fight her way and knock Rosaluma from the S tier she was put in by the first tier list by Smashboards (which was released 2 days before Corrin and Bayonetta). Who knows, Sheik may finally have some competition.
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Offline Captain Jigglypuff

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Re: What do you think of Smash 4?
« Reply #149 on: February 06, 2016, 19:32 »
I'm actually wondering where Shantae placed in the ballot? She would have been interesting to use in battle if they let her have a couple transformation dances for certain moves and the Pirate weapons as part of her Smash moves. Her Final Smash could have even been her using the lamp from Pirate's Curse to suck her opponents into the lamp where massive damage occurs or have Risky show up in a huge pirate ship and start firing large cannons at other players.
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